World Anvil for Story Bibles, Organization, Discovery (To Write & Have Written)

In this bonus episode, I welcome the fabulous ShyRedFox and SableAradia to explain the many features of World Anvil, a worldbuilding platform, for authors, from organization to content sharing to discovery.

Links mentioned in the stream:

World Anvil
Tutorials for a free account:
Follow Amy Winters-Voss:
Follow Diane Morrison:
Follow Laura’s Shard of Elan world:
Shard of Elan map:
Hacks & Help:

Video (from Twitch and YouTube):

To Write and Have Written: A Writer's Guide To The Business Side
To Write and Have Written: A Writer's Guide To The Business Side
Laura VanArendonk Baugh

<p>Writing is only part of a writing career -- no one warned us that we would need business acumen and entrepreneurship to be an author. Whether you're traditionally published or an independent self-publisher, it's good to have a leg up on accounting, marketing, time management, and other key skills.</p><br><p>These recordings of live discussion on craft and development, on business best practices, on explorations of fascinating and inspiring real life cool stuff, and more will help you along your writing journey and career development. Join Laura VanArendonk Baugh as she shares what she's learned and what she's learning. (Or join the weekly live discussion with your own questions!)</p><br /><hr><p style='color:grey; font-size:0.75em;'> See <a style='color:grey;' target='_blank' rel='noopener noreferrer' href=''></a> for privacy and opt-out information.</p>

(My apologies — we have a different transcription service this week.)


[00:00:00] spk_2: this’d is Laura VanArendonk Baugh, and you’re listening to To Write And Have Written, a writer’s guide to the business side. This is an audio recording of the weekly live Stream where you can join us each Tuesday on twitch. Details in a schedule of upcoming guests and topics can be found at Laura V A B dot com. Now to this week’s episode E

[00:00:24] spk_0: heard laughter That wasn’t okay, It’s back way have Chyron fox bag. Oh, yea, Alright. I’m gonna stop touching things. There’s no more touching the rest of the stream. I will sit across the room from my machine. I will waive gesture what I want. Oh my gosh. Two people at the same time. That is completely out of control. All right, we’ll get a third person so enforceable gets here. Um, it’s going to get even more exciting. So

[00:00:56] spk_1: we will

[00:00:56] spk_2: have it down by the time we were just a test.

[00:00:59] spk_0: Yeah, that’s it. Yes, we’re we’re just the were the pre show where the were the garage band that needs Thio. Warm up the crowd, so Alright, um thank you guys for coming in. We’re going to talk about world Anvil for riel now and I know that there is a large blank space on the screen where we’re going to be doing some screen sharing. And I’m not doing anything like right now You just get some small faces while we talk and a big blank screen, and that’s it. Like we’ll be back later. So All right. Um, S o, uh, why

[00:01:35] spk_1: are we

[00:01:35] spk_0: here? Um, let’s talk a little bit about World Anvil and what we wanted to do. And first of all, I just wanted to say, um, Amy pointed out, she red fox pointed out to me that today is a palindrome. So yea, welcome to our fantastic palindrome day. Um And then let’s let’s talk just a smidge about world anvil because I had never even heard of world Anvil until a few months ago because e think I’d seen the name, but there’s no you couldn’t have asked me like what it was, um And so I stumbled upon it. Um, just in time for World Ember, which is the World building challenge. Found out that shy red fox who I knew through Twitch, um is, like, really knowledgeable on, like, kind of a guru, and I’m like, Oh, hey, can I steal your brain and eso? That’s why, uh, that’s why we’re here tonight. Um, So I guess I can I Can I ask you to do, like, this super brief summary of world anvil For those people who are not familiar with it, as I was not some months ago.

[00:02:37] spk_2: Okay. Well, um, Aziz, best I can tell you because I’m not the creator for that, but I just I love using it. Um, it’s a world building platform for anybody. For authors, role players, Um, G m’s game designers, etcetera eso like as an author, you could build a world wiki. Or you could release secrets to your readers or, um, just so many different things. And so it’s just an incredible platform. I’ve been using it for over 1.5 years. A little bit over that night. E world anvil Half year anniversary was Christmas Day. So it xyz much a hobby for me as it is a tool because I love tinkering with it. It zika tinkerers dream on

[00:03:30] spk_0: and that’s the best kind of tool that you could just have fun experimenting with and Yeah,

[00:03:36] spk_2: I absolutely love it. Really, really quick. Background. Um, it’s a very small company. Um, it’s Demetris. Have leadeth and Janet Forbes. They are the two main people who started it. They do pretty much everything for it. They have some wonderful volunteers, a few developers, contest managers, social media platform people called n chanters. And they’ve developed an incredible, supportive community on discord, twitch, YouTube, Twitter and all of it. So it’s It’s not just the world building platform software. There’s, like the whole community behind it, and

[00:04:12] spk_1: that’s a big

[00:04:13] spk_2: part of what I love about it. And

[00:04:15] spk_0: that’s something that I was like surprised to discover, you know, I came in and I was like, Oh, there’s a website And then I’m like, Oh, my gosh, there’s like, this passionate community around this website that I had no idea, and I think probably passionate community is the best way to explain that. Hey, Stables in. I’m gonna see if I

[00:04:31] spk_1: could do it. E see

[00:04:33] spk_0: if I could get everybody on the screen at the same time. Okay. Oh, that is Nobody wants me. Hold on a second. Give me you. Nobody wants my nobody wants my zoom avatar. Let me see if I can make this happen. Um,

[00:04:48] spk_1: yeah. You might end up with you, Zoom avatar and shy and me and you know who knows

[00:04:54] spk_0: what we’ll like. I am. Ah. So sorry about the chaos. Oh, hey, look, I’ve got the two of you in, and then I’m gonna squeeze this up here, drift our chat over here, So

[00:05:08] spk_2: I

[00:05:08] spk_1: see on the top of the table pad here. Yeah, all right. Got the chat over here. So if I’m, you know, looking over here, that’s what I’m doing is looking at the chat. Oh, and Danny says we can actually hear everybody. I’m this. So about

[00:05:25] spk_0: that. Okay. Thank you so much for confirming that because I was just gonna, like, panicking quietly. Okay, You know what? I think everything’s on the screen market, and I’m not touching. Touching anything. No touching. Okay. All right. Um hey, can I ask you to to introduce yourself, since we’re just free forming the start of this here completely. Um, So, uh, I read Fox has been telling is just a smidge about her experience with World anvil and so sable. Would you mind giving us just a brief introduction to yourself and what you do with World Anvil.

[00:05:58] spk_1: Okay, Sure. Well, my name’s Diane Morrison. I’m known in the community is stable Oradea and, uh, especially the world landfall community. And basically, I’m using it for my primary writer platform. At the moment, I have to Siri’s that I write in and I’ve created a world for each of them. And I’ve incorporated that with my patryan. My patrons get access to fiction that is published on World and Falls Manuscript, uh, format, which it’s kind of like the beta reader version. Right? It will end up being a, you know, physical book when it’s done, but they get to see it before anybody else does. And I serialize chapters weekly.

[00:06:39] spk_0: Okay, so that Z actually a pretty cool application there because, like, people are getting, people are getting the sneak preview, but then they’re still getting the whole book. So that’s not your release platform. That’s your That’s your teaser platform. That’s exactly awesome. Awesome. Okay, um, so let me just preface this with as I as I warned these poor people who agreed to come on and tonight I don’t, um I know just enough now about world anvil to be dangerous and to make myself sound either slightly clever or really dumb, by the way I phrase my questions. So thanks Jared Fox were throwing that in the chat so people can see where we are and maybe want to follow along. Um, so one of the things I want to mention is World Anvil has many, many tears of, you know, pay tears and, you know, pro tears. But the free tier is really quite featured. Is that the right way to say that? Like, there’s a ton you can dio without ever having to to upgrade? Um, So if you would like to jump in and kind of follow along with us, feel free, that’s not going to cost you anything. And you can actually get a lot of a lot of mileage without having to upgrade. So by change, stopping by So

[00:07:57] spk_1: organized. James. Sorry. I was going to say if people want to know some of what they could do with the free account right now, Davina Andrew in that, sir, I’ll put that in a chat. She is doing an entire Siris on what you could do with free account, right? And then she’s going toe work on what you can do from the journeymen and so you can check it out. If

[00:08:23] spk_0: you throw in chat everything that’s going all the links that are going to chat, I will put in the show notes as well. So those will be collected for the replay on DPI, other places that this video ends up so they will all be there. So, um so background how I got here on my to do list for an embarrassing long, long time has been to make a wiki for one of my epic fantasy, Siri’s and I actually attempted it, using some fairly standard wiki software, which I hated, Um, and so I didn’t get it done because I hated using it. So stumbling upon World Anvil, which was much more user friendly and much more featured, was actually really cool. Um, but then I’m looking at this and I’m seeing all these, you know, again, all the journeymen and sage tears and everything, and I’m like, Okay, obviously this is useful for far more than just a wiki. And then I’m starting to explore what other people are doing with it. So can you tell me, um what are the features that you’re using beyond Just as a story Bible for yourself or for your readers? Um, you know, uh, Jared Fox mentioned secrets, and you mentioned, you know, uh, stable mentioned. Um uh, you know, teasers and and previews. What are the things are you able to do with this beyond just the I now know which character has red hair?

[00:09:48] spk_2: Um, one of the some of the things I’ll go through really quick, and then I’ll give a sable to turn. But I do a lot of tutorials, so I use a lot of stat blocks on day there in the role playing features. But that’s really the only role playing feature I use. And what you can do is you can create information in one place and then pop it all over. And then if you need to update it, you updated in one place. You don’t have to worry about going toe like 15 different pages and updating that. So I use stat blocks a lot. Um so, like, I have a list of all my books and stories, and then I set it up to be. This is complicated, but I can show somebody how to do it on

[00:10:32] spk_0: Get me. Just clarify real fast using slap stat blocks. But not for character stats. Not because

[00:10:37] spk_2: no, actually, actually, I will, um, show you guys if I’ll pop it into the thing, and then I’ll actually open up my character. So if we can share that on the stream,

[00:10:54] spk_0: Yeah, if you throw that into if you screens here in discord, that because we don’t need the audio out of discord because we are hanging

[00:11:03] spk_2: out. So hopefully that will work. Um, on I can only have so many things going on at once. I can’t see if it showed up. So

[00:11:14] spk_0: e don’t let me see that is yes, yes, I’m going to adjust it. So it’s more visible, but we have it so you can speak and I’ll make it pretty

[00:11:27] spk_2: Okay. Eso what I did Because I’m a geek. I’m a former programmer. I love to tinker with things. And so what I’ve done a couple of things with my characters was I made clickable secrets. So like if I screwed down here because I know this is the secret area on I hold it. I have things that pop up so people can go and make the pages a little bit more interactive, and so they can click on the pages and find the secret. So for maybe he wanted to be a Catuna. As a kid, you can click on that and find that I I also set up a set of access groups so people that people can self subscribed to So they want to learn more secrets from images, point of view or Nakamura’s point of view or secrets from book for book to that, they can click on thes. And then these different colored boxes will show up with information for them that they wouldn’t get otherwise. To my, I also did one more quick thing on day that’s. I made a list of all the books I have or will have and the little short stories that go along with them, um, kind of this fight stories, and then I tell it, which ones to show and that’s a little bit complicated, but it could show somebody how to do that, and I hope to do that in a tutorial some point. But so like images and rise guardian and these these three stories and so they show up, and then people can go linked to those and I will have a way to link back to that, too. So there’s that block. I just pop into every character and every speech fees, and then people can check out what

[00:13:15] spk_0: time saver. You’re just referencing at one time, and you only have to update it once. That’s cool. Can we Can we scroll back because you’ve got a relationship chart? I think that

[00:13:24] spk_2: just went, Oh, yes, there are. These are the family trees, and I have not done half assed. Much of with family trees is a lot of other people because, uh, part of the family tree aspect I’m keeping as a secret. I’m not letting everybody know all of the things that our family trees, but also some of my characters just don’t have as much history written into the books yet. Eventually that may have come about, but not yet, but you can get very, very detailed with these family trees.

[00:13:56] spk_0: Oh my gosh, I opened up like the family trees and the relationship charts options, and it was it was like looking at, you know, the War of the Roses layout. So I mean, you could do so many crazy overpowered things there. So we’ll do that in a bit, because I that’s overwhelming. OK, eso um stable. What? What would you like to point out on that?

[00:14:19] spk_1: Well, there’s okay related to what, uh, I was just talking about right. There’s also organization relationship charts where you can chart people’s diplomatic relations or lack thereof in a easy to follow diagram, which is awesome when you’re writing space opera, I’ll tell you, because that can get complicated politically, Um, they’ve got just the article. Templates themselves are really useful because it’s not just okay. I’m gonna put all this general information in a wiki, right? It’s like, Okay, here’s a template for a battle, right? And it’s got all the fields laid out for you. Who were the belligerence, which is what you call the two sides of a conflict, right? Who? You know, what was the units involved, right? What was the date that it happened? And it’s all just right there to suggest what you need. Tohave, you don’t have to use all of the information But what is there, you know, is a good way to get you thinking about how you might present it. And, of course, like you said, Right, you can let people different, No different things, right? I have different levels of my patryan that are integrated and depending on what level you have subscribed, that you get more and more information, right. I’m also along with my husband, creating a role playing game statistics so that if you want to take these worlds and say, you know, play them in Dungeons and Dragons, you could do that. We have information for that. He’s the guy who’s putting that together, right? And it’s also designed to work as a role playing game platforms. So it’s really easy to incorporate. I mean, how many times have you I don’t know. Did you get on to play a role playing games at all? Right? Don’t just Dragon Section stuff yet. So how many times have you been reading? You know, I don’t know. The Mercedes Lackey books and your, like, Geez, this would be really great in a role playing game.

[00:16:14] spk_0: Yeah, yeah. No, I totally and and that’s one of the things I’ve looked as soon as I told somebody that I was gonna get on world Anvil and they were like, So are are we getting the syriza’s that world as a role play setting And I’m like, let me figure out how to wiki first and then we’ll talk, you know? So, yeah. Um, yeah, thanks, Jared Fox, for sharing that. Everything’s coming in the chat. Thanks. They We’ll keep that again. All of this stuff is going to go into the show notes. Um, so this is one of the things that I was you know, looking at this, looking at all these options. And I know that you guys were talking about secrets and sneak peeks and all of these things. So what is how does that information management, I guess, Work where? You know, I look at okay, this is stuff that people from readers of book one might want to come. But I don’t want them to see this stuff from book three yet, right. And you know, So how can that information parts out and stable? You said you’ve got tears on your patryan which gives people access, which is a great way, um, to do that. But that’s I guess, um uh, patryan. That’s that’s a, uh, fan access as opposed to a chronological access. Like, is there what are my options for doing secrets and parsing out information?

[00:17:27] spk_1: Well, I have something for that to actually write. If you go to my community hub, you’ll see that there are self assigned subscriber groups that you could just choose. Right? And I’ve got you know, I’ve read Book one. I’ve read Book two. I’ve read Book three. If you really wanna go and select those all yourself and get all that information without having read the books, that’s your problem, right? Some people like opening the Christmas present before Christmas. I don’t care. Go for it. But if you don’t want spoilers, this will prevent you from having spoilers. Now, granted, there’s still some stuff that’s Onley available to patrons, but that’s you know, that’s how I lay out the chronological.

[00:18:06] spk_0: No, that’s fantastic. I had I didn’t. This is why I wanted to talk to people. I didn’t even know these were options. This is great.

[00:18:11] spk_2: Yeah, these are under your world settings. There’s access, Andi. That’s where you’ll you’ll want to set up different access groups so you can set it up for, like, team secrets or book secrets or patriot groups or whatever you want. So

[00:18:28] spk_0: So I know especially like I read Fox. I know I’ve watched you stream where you’re working on your CSS and doing customization is and, um and, uh, you know, just what I know the entire thing is extremely customizable. So for people who are super CSS geeks, just go to town, have a great time. If I am, uh, you know, don’t come. I can do CSS. It’s not what I do for fun. Like e think So what might be other people’s options? Um, if you want Thio play with that a bit and you could please fill three. If you want to throw anything up on the screen, I’ll bring it back

[00:19:07] spk_2: so we can see stuff. E was just trying to think I’ve been doing some serious toe help people be brave enough to try CSS and people are always like, Oh my gosh, I don’t want to blow it up like you’re not gonna blow it up. All you do is you. You know, you go into the editor and take it out and it goes back to the way it waas, so you never can really blow it up. Eso just so you know. But there’s the help channels in the disk, please, if you get on world and we’ll get on the discord and sync up your account to the discourse so that you can get access to, like the help channels and everything. So because that’s where I started learning, I had done CSS when it first came out. God knows how long ago on. Then I had to like, totally relearn because everything has changed. When I learned first, it’s not. It was like flashing text, and now today it’s much more swap. Yes, okay, lets selling

[00:20:07] spk_0: rainbow flashing and yeah,

[00:20:09] spk_1: but there’s a plenty

[00:20:10] spk_2: of different like containers you can use. You can use quote boxes and stuff and just little code snippet the world anvil BB code tags. So there’s plenty to play with, even if you don’t want to play with CSS. And there’s different themes. If you’re if you purchase at least the journeymen, which is like less than five bucks a month, Um, subscription. You can do different themes and play with some of the C S s. So there’s a lot to tinker with and play with, even if you’re even if you’re not a CSS geek.

[00:20:42] spk_1: Hey, I’m not a CSS geek at all, right? So what I dio is I use one of the basic themes, you know, You select them, there is a variety that you can choose from, and one of them will be at least vaguely suited to what you want to do. Right Then from there you ask in the C S s help Channel. Hey, how do I do this effect, right? And people are very helpful. I’ve got this. I’ve got this beautiful menu button that’s on the side of every page. Everybody loves it. I am. You know, I just copied the code somebody gave me to do it and change the picture. I don’t have any idea how it works, but I get compliments on it all the time. And then from there, right, I don’t hardly use containers at all. Like there you can use containers and configure them with CSS, and I hardly ever use them. But I customize my there’s there’s two boxes that they give you automatically. There’s the quote box and there’s the allowed box, right? The allowed boxes intended for role playing games where here’s the section you read aloud to your players, but you can use it like a container. And that’s what I do with it. I did a little CSS to customize how it looked so that it was blue to contrast with the red one. That is my quote box. And I just use those pretty much and it looks beautiful.

[00:22:04] spk_0: Yeah, I had your tried to bring your thing up briefly, and I think I lost it from discord. So Yeah, there we go. Um, so if you

[00:22:16] spk_2: actually can I have stables thing up in the discord?

[00:22:21] spk_0: Yeah, that’s that’s what I’ve got now. So we can Okay, there we go. The Oh, yes. And, um yeah, because I

[00:22:30] spk_2: know this is from the new

[00:22:31] spk_0: I’m using a standard theme right now to, but because you can adapt the cover picture and whatnot it you can still customize even while you’re using somebody else’s. Ah, somebody else’s theme. Yes, E. I didn’t think that getting set. I manage on my own websites. I do all of that. You can so easily disappear down the rabbit hole of I’m going to spend the next eight hours moving this five pixels to the right and not actually update the content. So I’m trying to keep myself from doing that with World Anvil, so Yeah. Yes. So Okay. Um awesome. And so what? You know what? I’m going to just let me see if I can get this up here. Um, because I want to show how How If I could get mine up here, Can we do this? Yes. Is that up? No, it’s not. OK. This over here? Maybe not. Nope. It’s not going to let me do it. Okay? Never mind. Um, just trust me that you can get a variety of looks from the same theme. Um and, uh and we’ll just We’ll just assume

[00:23:47] spk_2: you want me to pull yours up? Yeah.

[00:23:50] spk_0: Discords having a small crisis and, uh, well

[00:23:55] spk_2: on my part. Computers. Ah, little warm. So it’s slow. Sorry.

[00:23:59] spk_1: I’ve got another friend, Graham Barber, who is, uh, using the same theme that I use for that world. The toy soldier saga for a a military post apocalyptic thing that he is doing and it looks totally different. Yeah,

[00:24:16] spk_0: because there’s quite a lot you can do even without going into a lot of the CSS customization. And I’m only just figured I got this is my shiny new cover picture because I was using a placeholder until I decided to commit. So, you know, I’m going to get there. It’s gonna be fine, but working toward it. So, um so yeah, and, um oh, with gorgeous book

[00:24:39] spk_1: cover. Beautiful book, Cover

[00:24:44] spk_0: E. Now that I know, I congrats, this stat blocks to make, like, book collections that’s on my list. I’m

[00:24:50] spk_1: gonna tap you for your Yeah.

[00:24:54] spk_0: Oh, yeah. I will happily share my cover designer. Yeah, great. Yeah. I love those covers. I’m not gonna lie kind of giggle when they show up in the email like, Ah, he’s a great So, Yeah, so All right. So one thing that I think you guys have both mentioned that kind of blew my mind, but also makes perfect sense is that you are using You know, we always talk about authors, need a platform, and you are using world anvil as your primary platform rather than you know, a central website or trying to stay on a different social media or something. So, um, can you just like, how did you choose that route? Was it a conscious decision or you just kind of happened. And now you’re staying there. And how do you How do you do that? How do you leverage this Azan author platform?

[00:25:42] spk_2: Um, I’m not published yet, but I have set up and run umpteen WordPress sites, and I Yeah, I have fun setting it up, but I hate writing posts and setting and maintaining it. And, um, I just had some bad experiences with were impressed. And so when I was able to figure out that I could set up like an author Page and I will have over to my author Page, Um, I set up a world for my author page, and then I can link to everything from that. So my my author Page Amy Winters Foster Calm comes to here, and I need to fix the u. R. L think there was a long story, a mess. I was one of the guinea pigs for the u. R l thing. Um, but eso I have everything linking from here. If people come here they can find out about my books, and when they’re coming out, they can sign up for my newsletter. They consign up. So it’s basically kind of mire. Author. Platform funnel. You check out the books, check out the newsletter, check out the discord all the places that they want to find me. That used to be my WordPress site. So it’s it’s replaced my WordPress for me, right?

[00:26:58] spk_0: But I’m still using a your custom domain to get there or will be e

[00:27:04] spk_2: can get there from here. It just shows world anvil right now. So once once I get there. So

[00:27:10] spk_0: that’s sort of yeah and unstable.

[00:27:13] spk_1: Yeah, I still have a WordPress site, and you can find my stuff under Diane Morrison fiction dot com But I kind of amusing that as my, uh, the word. I’m sorry, but I’ve been of a headache, and sometimes words slipped my brain, but it’s where you distribute it everywhere else. You know, like you know, that’s what I’m doing with it. Right? Um but I’ve got a and again, I’m trying to remember the name that there’s there’s a couple of different functions out there that will let you take an RSS feed from something else and, uh, make a wordpress or, you know, or a social media post out of it or whatever automatically and then send it right. So that’s what I’ve got going on, right? It automatically pulls from the RSS for my worlds on world Anvil, and it circulates it to my were oppressed blawg, which then sends about everywhere else among you know, I’m on Twitter. I’m on Tumblr. Right? Um, everywhere. Right. Um e I don’t do Facebook anymore, but But it was sending it to Facebook, right? As well. And that my Amazon page Because it’ll said it there from the RSS from my wordpress blawg. And you know, my good reads page and all that stuff, right? And, uh, on top of that, though, world Anvil has its own social media functions that should not be neglected, right? Like, get on the discord again, right? There’s so few way have a million users, right? And what 10,000 of them are on the discord or something? That’s it.

[00:29:02] spk_2: It’s very under used,

[00:29:04] spk_1: like What are you doing? If you get on the discord, talk to people. Tell them about your world people will start checking it out from there because thes air people who are interested in what you are doing because they do it too. So they’re gonna want to check out your work, right? And then, you know, from there there’s also the social functions on world anvil itself. Like you have your own place where you could make a little feed post if you want Teoh right, which I’ve under used but intend to use more in 2021.

[00:29:33] spk_0: But I think that’s something that I read Fox I see all the time in my in my notifications, right that you’re constantly, you know, updating like hey, this new this article went up. This got this, got at it or it’s great, I get on and I immediately remember how little I’m accomplishing. So it’s

[00:29:49] spk_1: good, but yeah, that’s the other thing, right? You can follow other people’s worlds. You can follow their author page that you can keep track of everything that they’re doing, and then you get it directly in your notifications. Right? And I also have, uh, like there’s an automatic function where if you set up your discord link with your stuff on world. Advil in your I think it’s your user settings. Email. Correct me if I’m wrong, but you set it up and then it will just post your discord as well, right? So if you use if you have a discord server that you’re using and hey, if you have a patriot, you probably do because they designed that to integrate. Then they’ll just send it there, too, right? So it’s like I make the post. I you know, I release it to discord, you know, because there’s a button there to do that. Once you’ve made your post and I release it. Thio notify followers. The notify followers puts it in the RSS boom. It’s everywhere. One post I didn’t have toe copy and paste links anywhere.

[00:30:52] spk_0: I’m a huge fan of Do it once and then share it, you know, distributed And yeah, that’s

[00:30:58] spk_1: e love

[00:30:59] spk_0: those e

[00:31:00] spk_1: so important

[00:31:01] spk_2: to say that time

[00:31:02] spk_0: I’m sorry. What was that?

[00:31:05] spk_2: I was just saying It’s so important to say at that time, because as authors, we have to do so much now. It’s not like, especially as self published authors, because I know stable, self published I am going to be self published yourself published. There’s so much that we have to do now.

[00:31:24] spk_0: So thank you, Shaven and and Mikey for following. And then she even has a question about how we’re doing the distribution, the wide distribution across multiple social media.

[00:31:34] spk_1: Okay, I got a just a second. I will look up. What? The thing is that I’m using Hold on, because I forgot the name of it. But, uh,

[00:31:48] spk_0: sorry. I e switched to these headphones in the in the great audio debacle, and, um, they’re normally pretty comfortable, but I’ve actually got them pinching my my hair, and I don’t wanna move anything to do it, so I’m just gonna wriggle a little bit. Hold on. Um e

[00:32:08] spk_2: I was just trying to remember where everything was, but I didn’t wanna look it up on screen. E o

[00:32:17] spk_1: K e Xabier is what I am using. Oh,

[00:32:21] spk_0: yeah, Yeah, I love that happier than, um and that I use as happier for redistributing a lot of my material that I don’t wanna e I want on tumblr very technically, but I’m not super active on Tumblr. But I want my stuff to show up on tumbler, You know, that kind of thing. So, um yeah, and they have free and paid tears of service, so that’s a great

[00:32:45] spk_1: I’m just using a free tier. It does everything I needed to do.

[00:32:49] spk_0: Yeah. Yes, I am a big fans of automation. Just like please do this for me so I can focus on fun stuff. That’s

[00:33:03] spk_2: my brother. I have Thio decline his call. I call him back later. Sorry about that.

[00:33:09] spk_1: This is, by the way, this whole authors have to do so much thing. It’s true, even in traditional publishing nowadays. Unless you’re Stephen King, right? So you know? Yeah, we we need to find ways to save the time because we spend so much time doing social media and doing marketing that we’re not writing. And that’s crap. I don’t want any of that. I want to write, right?

[00:33:30] spk_0: Like, that’s why we did this. Nobody’s like, I wanna I wanna spend all my time trying to get to more followers. So I’m gonna be a writer like that zone for So, um, some of the other e just gonna answer in the chat real quick. Danny, the automation, uh, were primarily using zap your for that. So, um, so its able through a link for that into the chat. And, um yeah, so, anyway, sorry. Carry on. Sorry, E.

[00:33:59] spk_2: I was thinking, you know, since I have avoided doing the newsletter, one of the things that I can put into my newsletter is some of the things that I update in world. And because I keep I know I keep that updated. And so that’s some of the things that I can add to my newsletter. And I am looking actually looking forward to that because I was always like a newsletter. E

[00:34:22] spk_1: gave up on a newsletter. I don’t do one anymore. It’s such a waste of time. I just you know, I had a newsletter. I was getting a 1% open rate. I’m like, e get much more interaction this way. So screwed.

[00:34:37] spk_0: Yeah, Yeah, I do have a newsletter. It is. It is important to me. But the number one thing I get when I talk to other authors about newsletters is you sit down to write one and your mind just goes blank. Like you. I’ve done anything this month. Do what happened this month. What year is it? You know, like, that was just 2020 general, but, you know, the but having, you know. Okay, well, I published thes six articles, so I’m gonna Yeah,

[00:35:07] spk_1: we lost audio.

[00:35:08] spk_2: Yeah, we lost audio. Laura, we can’t hear you. Well, while we’re waiting, let’s go poke around on Laura’s page just to see what? Yes, so Oh, it’s not on the thing. I think I post. I put her. Um, Let’s go. I know. Okay? Laura went squeaky. Okay. It says on I’m not on the screen anymore.

[00:35:45] spk_1: How about Wade s? Where

[00:35:49] spk_0: If it’s possible to break tonight, it’s going Thio. I was not planning on using these headphones, so I didn’t have the battery fully charged, and then it was eso. But that’s because everything else I was having a crisis when we started, so Okay, um, let me get this. All right? Can you still hear me? Are we good?

[00:36:10] spk_2: E was just poking around on your world while we waited for you to come back a

[00:36:17] spk_0: day. So what did I miss? What happened?

[00:36:19] spk_2: Way were poking around. I’m your map. It’s gorgeous. E like that. So I was reading the first to be a charter will learn along bugs. I always wanted to know where stuff was, and this is great.

[00:36:32] spk_0: Yeah. So thank you, Shavon, for granting me some technical grace. I appreciate that. And, yeah, the we’re just gonna This is gonna be the exciting everything. Audio goes wrong night. So that’s how we’re doing this. Uh, yeah. So, um, let me see if I can get I’m gonna get uh yeah. So actually, let me ask you about maps, because I’ve discovered there are so many cool map options and world anvil that are interactive and way cooler than my static map, which is what I had. So, um, I’m just I was like, looking at this going I have so many new toys to play with, And it’s actually inspiring because I’m like, Oh, I should go ahead and write this down so that people can see where this happens kind of thing. So say, Well, I saw you react. Do you want to enthuse about map options?

[00:37:26] spk_1: Okay. The map options air. Amazing, right? I okay. I’m not a cartographer, so I use a lot of randomly generated type maps. Most of the utilities of which I learned from other people in the world and will community. And then I used the interactive tools right so you could make interactive map pins. You click on the map in It tells you stuff about the the thing there you could make invisible pins and lines that you just kind of mouse over. And then it tells you what’s going on there, right? You can make maps connect other maps you could make. You know, say, say you have ah, map of space. Like Ideo, right? It’s a space opera toy soldier saga, so I have a map of known space then I don’t have them all set up yet, but the plan is You click on that star system and it’ll give you a map of the system. Right. Then you can click on any one of those planets in that star system, and I’ll give you a map of the planet and so on, right, and you can do that over and over again so that it’s completely interactive. It’s amazing what you can do with it.

[00:38:36] spk_0: Yeah, and that was one way I just looked at that, and I’m like, Oh, my gosh, this is so much more than I ever would have hoped to build for myself. And it’s already done, and it’s built for me. So, um so, yeah. Um oh, we can’t follow a world. I’m sorry. Is that my world or somebody else’s world?

[00:38:53] spk_2: Yeah, I think it’s your world. Because if I go to your home page, there’s no follow options. Uh huh.

[00:39:00] spk_0: I probably just broke that somehow because I touched it. So I’ll look at that when we’re done here, so

[00:39:06] spk_2: I’ll help you figure it out.

[00:39:08] spk_0: All right? Yeah. So it’s Zaveri baby stage now. Anyway, you’re not missing so much, but it’ll get better. I promise. Okay. Right. So all right. And yes. And books. There are books. So many books. Um all right. So yeah, thanks for explaining some of that map stuff because I don’t I just know that there’s more than I know how to use. So, uh, but I love what you said about, you know, being able to go from, you know, Galaxies to individual planets to individual places on the planet and just click straight through all of that that SSM Google maps level

[00:39:43] spk_1: down to individual buildings and rooms. If you want?

[00:39:47] spk_0: Yeah, Yeah, and And because Because one thing that impressed me about world Anvil again, I’m so new to it. Every every time I discover something, I’m like we, um But I keep seeing, you know, there’s so many platforms out there for, you know, running role playing games. Or there’s, you know, platforms out there that is specifically for a timeline for a novelist or something. And World Anvil has all of that rolled into one because even though it’s hugely used for gaming, uh, worlds and gaming communities, it actually started, as I just recently learned, as a novel, ING Aid. So that’s why it works so well for writers is because it’s not us trying to tack on to a game system, but it actually started, as I think. But then you’ve got all that all these game tools in there, and since I mentioned timelines, I just discovered timelines. They’re

[00:40:38] spk_1: coming in, they’re

[00:40:39] spk_0: kicking my butt, but they’re really cool. So I have

[00:40:42] spk_2: Laura, just so you know, timelines are getting better soon. That’s one of the things coming up.

[00:40:50] spk_0: I’m not even blaming world anvil for it. Like i e. I’m totally I’m owning all the technical errors. Right now, they’re all mine, every one of them. So but I am excited to hear that because, um, because you can dio already you can put like, um, you can have your multiple eras in your story like there’s there’s the actual I don’t want to say physical time, but there’s there’s the grand chronology of your world, you know, for them from the Earth’s crust began to cool all the way down to modern day. But then you can have different eras and different timelines within the era, because this culture is counting time this way, and this culture is counting time this way. And I just looked at it. My ha! So are you guys Do you want to talk about what you guys are doing with timelines or

[00:41:33] spk_2: I have not done that much with timelines? Have you done much with the timeline

[00:41:36] spk_1: stable? I’m in the process of using it to keep track of the timeline of my novels. It’s really important to me because I have this calcula. I’m terrible remembering dates and how much time has passed and you know, this is why I’m late for everything but Yeah, I’m finding it very useful for, uh, keeping a chronology of my books, right? The that events, those air, those air patryan secrets, right? You don’t get to see the timeline of the novel unless you’re you know, But some of the events have wider spread implications in the world. And those appear on a different timeline, right? That is keeping track of those particular events that are important to the world history. Right? And then that’s for everybody. Right? And then, um let’s see, you can you can also like, you can create the one event right and then select different timelines to put it on right. I’m also keeping you know, timelines for individual books and then timelines for the whole thing. Right? So, um, on I’m chronically behind on the work on it because it is a bit time consuming the way it is set up, but it’s going to get better soon. Like she says, there’s an update coming to the way that the timelines work and the calendars work, and they’re rolling it into one. And I’m loving it because the one complaint I had was the difficulty of keeping track of because I do have cultures that keep track of things with different calendars. And I’m like, what year is it inthe e abalone in calendar? And then what year is it in the form Orien calendar? Right. And but it’ll just do that in the update. I won’t have to think about it, right? It’ll just do it.

[00:43:23] spk_0: Magic. Integration. Oh, fantastic. Yeah. Yeah. And I’m I just was really happy to see I could start putting things into, um, into order, like thes last couple of books. Like, I understand everything when everything is happening. But it’s, um for whatever reason. Like I’m having the slippery is time hanging onto the timeline while I’m working on them. So just being able to slot things in being able, some stuff is public. Some stuff is secret, so I’m not accidentally dropping spoilers. But I can see you know where stuff is going and the built in features of Okay, I this events on the timeline and then all within that is as stable, mentioned earlier. The templates air so useful and so helpful. And they’re already built in for you. So I could say Okay, this event, it took place, you know, It’s a military conflict. It took place at this location. These people were involved. All of that is linked prettily into that timeline event so that I’m not trying to massage code to make sure all the links work and to make sure that they look good thing Aesthetic is baked in, Which is great for people like me.

[00:44:28] spk_1: Exactly. Yeah, I’m lazy to I want to do things once. I don’t want to screw around with it forever. I want it done once you know somebody else. Yeah, that’s right. Absolutely. I have enough to do. Um, Did you know that you can now also link it to specific parts of your manuscript if you put your manuscript on your level?

[00:44:48] spk_0: I did not. Because I haven’t done anything with manuscript said.

[00:44:51] spk_1: Oh, so you

[00:44:53] spk_2: will like it. Um, that’s That’s where the story links were. Let me hop back over here, you know, um yeah, but let me show you a couple things. S o e. Need a character. Give me a character. Uhh Made chicken good. Mhm. And one of the things I’ve been doing, because when you link to a manuscript, you can get an image but you don’t get anything about that. So one of the things I’ve been doing again, it, uh, let’s let’s hop over to a manuscript. Um, it in initiation is, is on a manuscript, so we can open one up. When you when you hop into it, you can get your summary. And I do a lot of formatting and my stuff, so it but eso I give people a summary of rating and stuff of that, and then I list what characters were in there. So I pop article blocks in there. Um, what organizations? Anything’s in from informational. And then, um, my tags on maybe some of the research I had for it, and then you can go and open it up and read it.

[00:46:12] spk_1: He’s really cool stuff. I’m taking notes because I’m gonna I’m looking at this stuff doing

[00:46:17] spk_0: the back of my head. I’m like, I’m gonna watch this video four more times, like just me. I’m just going to sit here and take the notes, so yeah,

[00:46:23] spk_2: I will be doing some author tools, stuff, um, on my hex and help block just because the author side is not as developed, and so I’ve been like. Okay, how do we get a block with manuscript summaries? Anyway, here’s what the manuscript look like. And then you can just keep continuing clicking to the the next part on Ben. Oh, come on, Pop. Back up here. Uh huh. What did I call it? Books. Thanks,

[00:46:56] spk_0: Chavan. Enjoy your dinner. Hey, D M stretch. Welcome.

[00:47:01] spk_2: What did I have? I had a list of stories. Was it stories? E can’t remember what? I called it off the riots companion stories. There we go. Um, stocks. So what I did was I created a block that people can make a copy off. Um, and this again, this isn’t all about me. I just want tools that people can use because again, when you have a manuscript, you get a picture, which is great, but I want to know what it is before I go click on it. So I made it so you can make a summary and references and give it some tags. So s so that would be available on then. I also did a similar thing for my characters. Um, on.

[00:47:48] spk_0: Make sure some point like not to interrupt you in mid sentence, but drop a link to your tips and hacks. Um, blogged because

[00:47:56] spk_1: I stumbled

[00:47:57] spk_0: upon that when I first got into world Anvil and I was like, This is really useful. I know this person. So it was

[00:48:04] spk_2: Yeah. This is what I did here. Thes

[00:48:07] spk_1: air, just

[00:48:07] spk_2: article blocks. And I put their character pictures in there so we can basically have a listing of all of our characters by books, just with article blocks. And then you can in here. I’ll show you how I did this thes two I listed separately because I wanted specifically. But then you can tell you want, like, four columns across emotional people how to do that. But these were just the article blocks and I the major characters. I just tell it, um, tagged by or something like that. I have tow edit it, and then I give it a tag, and it lists small for me, so I don’t have to go in and manually edit it all the time. Uh, I’m gonna call that just a second here. How did I do that? Tagged. And then then I have a tag called book one Major. Um and so it lists them all out for me. So it’s automatically done,

[00:49:01] spk_0: and then you and people could make that is detailed or as simple as individuals wanted to do. So one thing I tell you know, because if you’re if you’re new to the stream tonight, um, I run a weekly live stream on the business of creativity And so we talked about marketing. We talk about, you know, careers and all kinds of things. But one of the things I try to mention frequently is Don’t let it bully you. Don’t let the task bully you. Um, you can, you know, you can start with what you want to start with and then build out like don’t look. Oh, gosh, Marketing, It’s huge, You know, Don’t let it pull you scary world angle has a lot of stuff as I’m discovering. So I’m picking this spot Wanna work with and then I’ll pick another spot I wanna work with So but yeah, here’s the Here’s the block that I found It has lots of useful information on that. So yeah, thanks for sharing that link.

[00:49:54] spk_2: Part of why I started writing this is I had a hard time learning it and I hung out in the half the channel that help channel and discord on the world and all that. And I just started making notes on a lot of these are my notes. And then I tried to tidy them up. So because other people started reading them. So it’s this started because I needed notes, and then I’ve shared what I learned is I lived it, so

[00:50:19] spk_0: yeah. Yeah, Well, thank you for taking the time to write them down for the rest of us. See, we really appreciate it. It’s a huge time saver, too. So, um yeah. So Okay. I’m sorry. Just catching up in the in the chat stretch, fell asleep and needs a pizza. So before get you just said Hey,

[00:50:39] spk_1: what jerk didn’t silence her

[00:50:41] spk_0: cell phone before she went on livestream. That would be some blond sitting here, so Okay. Yeah, carry on s Oh, no, no, she would fax. That was not a jab at you. That was the fact that mine has gone off twice. Just while we were having in one sentence. So we’re Yeah, that’s on.

[00:50:58] spk_2: I didn’t hear.

[00:50:59] spk_0: Okay. Good, Good. Maybe it was far enough away from my mic, But it was it Zmuda now, So Okay. All right. Um yeah. So, um uh, Se But when you talked about using this with with patryan, Um, like, how did you set up your monetization and feel free to tell me that? That’s not a question I’m willing to answer in a public stream. That’s totally fair. But, you know, as far as you know, are you? Is that primarily Thio to divide up your your your subscriber access, like you talked about earlier? Do you does that actually a source of income for you? How do you How did you set up that? You know it monetization. I’m gonna leave that wide open. You could take that wherever you would like Thio.

[00:51:45] spk_1: Right? Well, it’s, uh, tidy side income at the moment. I won’t call it like, you know it’s not Ah, it’s not a big income maker, Right? But it is growing all the time. Um, it’s not, you know, it’s not a pathetic drop in the bucket either. So this is, you know, and uh okay, So I set up my patryan like, ages ago, and it was very slow moving, and I didn’t get a lot of response, you know? And I kept trying different things and, you know, right. But then, um, I when I I’ve only been involved for world and and world handful for just over a year, right? It was my present to myself for finishing Nano on a personal record time. Not this year, but last year, right? And they had a sale. So I went for the, um I think, yeah, the master membership instead of the journeymen because it was about the same price is I would have paid for the journeymen, right? And it came with Cem integrated features that, you know, said you can have, you know, subscriber groups and integrated with your patryan. And it showed you how to do that. And I started doing that in. My patrons responded to it like nothing else I’ve ever done. They love it, right? They they’re delighted to support it. Right. So I’ve been upgrading my membership ever since, Right, um, at stage level, it, um which is the Professional guild membership, right? It directly interfaces with patryan so that you, you know, have to do practically nothing to make it work. Just do your initial set up and then it, you know, automatically subscribes, you know, gives people subscribe link and they go there and then they get the material that specifically for that level of whatever patriot level they have. And I mean, like, and it’s just kind of been snowballing from there with very little effort on my part. Really, I’m just doing the stuff that I would be doing anyway and, you know, with a couple of little special features for the more you know, the higher level tears and that’s it, right, and it’s, Yeah, it’s It’s great. I’ve never been so happy with it. I’d like to point out that about 90% of what I do on world and Full is completely available free to the public, right? Most of my basic world building stuff is just all there for you to look at, right, my Siri’s Bible and and Fan Wiki, Except I’m making it, you know. But there’s, you know, about 10% of the material. That’s for patrons alone, right, But at the rest of it, I have to do it anyway because I have to make a serious Bible. So I just make what is convenient to make available to the public and that gets people interested and it draws the man. This is what I mean about it being a my primary platform, right?

[00:54:41] spk_0: E. And it’s great that it you know, that that it just was such a natural process for you Because I’m self published author I published both traditional and self published. But my novels, my long form stuff, is self published. I’m from the Midwest and like going out and be like Hi, Please love me and give me money is like the worst the worst you know, so eso you know, hearing that, um the people who are already with you who just kind of rolled naturally into supporting that in another way that Zaw Cem I’m so happy to hear that. So yeah. Um OK, so yea alright,

[00:55:23] spk_1: I feel you. I’m a hybrid author to, and I hate marketing myself. I’m Canadian, You know, blowing your own horn is culturally frowned upon. I have to kick myself hard in the butt to make myself go out and do it. I love stuff that makes it simple, and I don’t really have to blow my own horn and It’s great.

[00:55:42] spk_0: Yeah. And, you know, like, I’m gonna My my other brain is going to jump in for a moment to be like marketing shouldn’t be high, love me and send me money. But it will feel like that. Even if you’re doing marketing properly, it’s still going to feel like that. Particularly if you’re from the Midwest or Canada. Um, sorry. That’s just it’s baked in. We’re gonna I was at a writer’s conference years years back, and we had e think it was Jane Friedman who who said guys, you know, this was a Midwest Conference, and she’s like, Guys, you have to get over this Midwest. You have to talk like I’m sorry. We just get help it. Yeah. So

[00:56:22] spk_2: baked in really seriously

[00:56:23] spk_0: way Sit down. And we look at the newsletter were like, Who wants to know anything I’ve done in the last month. So what? 2020. And I haven’t done anything in the last month, so Yeah. Hey, thanks. Thanks. Stretch for stuff and by appreciate it, catch you later s awesome. So Okay. Um uh oh, man. I think I made some notes about questions I wanted to ask. I’ve been hitting them completely out of order. So let me check my notes real quick. Excuse me. Um and and yeah, I guess also anything that you guys, I don’t I may not even know enough to know what to ask, right? So if anything, you guys are like, Laura, have you seen this would be the time to throw that out, because I might not have.

[00:57:11] spk_2: I do have a bit of advice for newbies. Two world anvil. There are the wonderful, incredible, seriously detailed article form. So, like, if you have a character, I mean that you could list pretty much any everything about this character, and they put so much time into these. But if you fill out every single aspect, you’re gonna have a non article that’s so ridiculously along that nobody can read it all. So fill out on Lee. What’s important to you? Don’t feel like you have to fill it all out.

[00:57:45] spk_0: Don’t spend time filling that out. That you could be spending writing about what that character does. Like you still need way. Still want books at the end of this? Okay.

[00:57:54] spk_1: Your protagonist article might look like that. Don’t do it for you know the guy he met who keeps the shop down the street, you know,

[00:58:03] spk_0: right? Yeah. And especially for some of us speculative writers. Aziz, we are here. Um, it’s really easy to get distracted in the research or the plausible or will world building or whatever. So, guys, this is a tool. It’s not the goal itself. It is a tool, so yeah, but sometimes we wanna go play. And that’s fine, too. So, um yeah, and actually, um, you know what you were talking about with the templates, those air Also great tools to help you develop things. And when we just did world Anvil in December and they had the daily prompts for world Denver and I ended up writing about stuff in my world that I had vague ideas of. But I hadn’t developed to that degree. But I developed it to that degree because there was a prompt that I wanted to get credit for completing the prompt. Eso eso totally use the tool. Okay? Absolutely. You use it for what it’s good for. And then where it stops being useful for you. Don’t don’t let it put you so

[00:59:06] spk_2: the contests are the same way get involved in the contest, get involved in the community that way. But if there’s something that really doesn’t work with your world, don’t She wanted it. So

[00:59:18] spk_1: yeah, I made a promise to myself, this world, Ember. I was not going to get distracted by promise if the prompt worked and I needed to write that I was going to write it if I didn’t. I wasn’t going Thio so And that worked out very well for me. So

[00:59:36] spk_0: and sometimes we just have to set ourselves some parameters because things could get very shiny. E I want some of that sparkle, but yeah, ultimately, guys, it’s about making books. So, yeah, don’t get distracted. So yeah, thanks for Thanks for mentioning that. But there are so many cool templates that again, I would never have thought about some of this stuff. So it’s out there, so find what’s useful to you. Use that live the rest go. So, um okay. So, actually, I’m gonna just remind the chat. If you guys have specific questions, please mention them. I’m not actually sure how long we’ve been running because our front end with so chaotic, but

[01:00:21] spk_1: e

[01:00:22] spk_0: was just like I feel like it’s been about an hour. So that’s thank you. Because I had enough panic going on. Checking the time was not what I was doing. Um, but thank you. Uh, first of all, both of you guys for being patient with my technical meltdown over here and everybody in the chat and watching thank you guys for being patient with me as well. And we did not have Thio revert to interpretive dance for the stream. We did get audio, so that worked out nicely. Thanks for being patient, but are there any questions? Um, that that we can We can take advantage of our pool of knowledge here that you guys want to throw into the chat. And I know we’ve had some people coming in who I have seen on twitch streams and chat. So we may have a very knowledgeable chat, and yeah, you give me information,

[01:01:16] spk_1: recognize lots and lights for sure.

[01:01:19] spk_0: So Okay. Danny says we do. We want to make books. Yeah. Yeah, that would be totally Yep. Um okay, so and yeah. So what I am going to do is probably wrap this here. I am so grateful for you guys coming and sharing information as I’m not even kidding about. I’m going to go back and and take notes over what you guys were saying tonight because this is, um this is great info. And, um, the world building diseases will take over the world S o. Um,

[01:01:53] spk_1: if you or if anyone else in the chat or you know who’s watching this on the beauty later or whatever has any questions don’t hesitate to get in touch with either one of us. I’m sure we’ll be happy to help. We’re on the world Anvil discord all the time we’re in. You know, I’m on Twitch. She’s on twitch. Really

[01:02:14] spk_0: nice. They talked to me. I’m still here. It’s great. So Okay. Um okay. So again, I am just really appreciative that you guys agreed Thio, tell me just just to put this in perspective for you guys watching, um poor, you know, I read Fox was just like, Hey, this is great. Let me know if you need to help, and I’m like, yeah, can we do it? Life on stream s so nice to agree to that. So mad props to both of these guys please check out all of their stuff. Make sure they’ve been putting links in the chat, but make sure you check check them out, and then I’m going to wrap this. Thank you guys. Have an awesome night. Everybody involved. And, um, yeah,

[01:02:58] spk_2: yeah, yeah. I have always loved reading your books, and it’s just awesome to do too. Be here with you today. Thank

[01:03:07] spk_1: you. Check in

[01:03:08] spk_0: the mail. Okay. All right. Bye, everybody. Thank you for

[01:03:15] spk_2: listening. You can find details on the weekly livestream upcoming guests and topics subscription and support information and more at laura v a b dot com. Your shares, reviews and support are very much appreciated until next time.

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